Item abilities/uses, organizing and updating

From: Nahl_Shadore
Date: 2002-05-11 23:31:06

we are already planning on having an item tree
(item->weapon->bladed->sword->gnomish->gnomish sword of bloody vengeance)
and we'll use it for things like blacksmith proficiency and fighting proficiency, correct?


what about if we make one more use of this heirarchy? this time for item abilities and uses?

eg

_level_ _abilities_
item throw

weapon pry, hit (yes, you can hit
someone with a bow)

bladed slash, stab, thrust, etc.

sword parry, deflect

Gnomish maybe all gnomish swords (being
small) have the ability to be
concealed or something. that's
something to be discussed
later, just an example.

Gnomish sword of every hit damages you slightly
bloody vengeance as well

etc.

all weapons would call their functions recursively (right word?) up the tree, just like making swords as a blacksmith updates recursively, making you better at all bladed weapons

this would make updating easier, too, since you wouldn't have to change every item with the ability, just the groups where the ability first occurs. say we want to make the "thrust" attack cause both cutting (from the blade) and bludgeoning (from your own weight) damage, we'd just go to "bladed" and change that one, instead of all of them

and if we wish to make the "stab" attack different for daggers and swords, we could remove it from "bladed" and make 2 copies, one in each subcategory. the computer shouldn't know the difference, it would just recognize the function, same as always


phew...long post

From: yorkaturr
Date: 2002-07-29 13:34:14
In-Reply-To: 1491

I think this was already clear to everybody? In any case, this is exactly how it will be done.

From: ReSpawner
Date: 2002-05-22 18:18:07
In-Reply-To: 1491

I actualy think you shoudl be able to trow anything on your oponent =D liek its posible to trow a 2 handed sword on someone and if you are lucky then it can deal alot damage... just wanted to say that =D

From: Yendor
Date: 2002-05-12 16:14:35
In-Reply-To: 1491

This message is generally more for developers than for Nahl.

That seems like a good solution all right.
We could just drop the 'bladed' item from the tree and maybe even the 'sword' item making the tree look like this : item->weapon->gnomish->gnomish sword of bloody vengeance

When developing the longer tree the bladed and sword will serve pretty much as some catalog items with no code that would have to be used in that class and not the weapon class.

In weapon class, for instance we should calculate all damage. And in bloodybigrace->enormousaxe we would set values for all the damage types. Some of them would be of course 0, but this frees us from having so strictly categorized weapons like IIF in AD&D. Also if you have a weapon called asswhacker you won't have to search for its weapon class.

Also if we want to have different "stab" attack for some some weapon it will work like this.

weapon->stab(int power)
{

target->do_damage(power);

}

IF we want a weapon to have different stab behaviour from the default stab we can just write a new stab function.


dagger->stab(int power)
{

emote("Dagger makes evilly when swung around")
target->do_damage(power * 3.14);

}

And by the way. The tree will prolly go arother way around : ie gnomish weapons are descended from weapons. I hope it won't go the way : weapons includes gnomish weapons.
The result : item

From: Nahl_Shadore
Date: 2002-05-11 23:35:36
In-Reply-To: 1491

here's the spacing cleaner


_level_
-_abilities_

item
-throw

weapon
-pry, hit (yes, you can hit someone with a bow)

bladed
-slash
-stab
-thrust, etc.

sword
-parry
-deflect

Gnomish
-maybe all gnomish swords (being small) have the ability
to be concealed or something. that's something to be
discussed later, just an example.

Gnomish sword of bloody vengeance
-every hit damages you slightly as well

From: darshan
Date: 2002-05-12 13:46:22
In-Reply-To: 1492

So you're suggesting the inheritance of abilities in the item tree?
A theoretic "sword" item has ability X, therefore every item type derived from "sword" has it?

I like that concept. We should probably think more about its implications.

From: namhas
Date: 2002-05-28 10:19:24
In-Reply-To: 1492

Sounds doable. Perhaps we should invent a list of all generic items and make the tree already? :)

From: raeky
Date: 2002-05-19 17:34:55
In-Reply-To: 1493

but you should most defintly have the ability to have your item NOT inherit an ability. Say you have a gnomish sword but its been modified to be longer then normal, but retains all the same other features, (shape, ornimates, markings, etc) but its to long to be hidden easly.

Or say you had a pike that was huge and impossible to hide, but it was a unique pike weilded by a demi god and has been permenetly imbuned with the ability to be hidden, or made invisiable to anyone but a "true owner" or something, (gains such magical power by always drawing the tiny amount of magical energy difused in the air over a long period of time from the magical nodes.)

So items shouldn't EXPLICITLY gain the tree's inheritances.

From: Yendor
Date: 2002-05-22 12:46:05
In-Reply-To: 1511

If the tree parent has an attribute 'easeofhiding' with a value of X it will be a default value, not mandatory.

From: raeky
Date: 2002-05-22 19:10:30
In-Reply-To: 1531

my point exactly. but with far less words. :)

From: raeky
Date: 2002-05-22 19:12:14
In-Reply-To: 1534

it should be a skill to throw weapons accruately, knives for example, and swords can be thrown. Some things like say a bow wouldn't do you to much good but if you ran out of arrows it wouldn't hurt to toss at your oponents head anyway.

From: Nahl_Shadore
Date: 2002-05-23 03:52:41
In-Reply-To: 1535

of course every item is different, and abilities/stats and such would completely depend on the item, but for those base stats that don't change, we can organize them for ease of tracking, updating

all staffe give blunt damage, but a staff with a blade (scythe-like) would give stabbing/cutting too

this is just something to build off of

From: Nahl_Shadore
Date: 2002-05-23 03:49:38
In-Reply-To: 1536

exactly

damage could be based on weight, sharpness (if applicable), skill, etc
if you picked up a rabbit you just killed, you could throw it

you could also swing it at your opponent's head to whack him
that's why I had throw as default under "item". hit/strike could be as well

From: ReSpawner
Date: 2002-05-28 16:48:30
In-Reply-To: 1547

so then it whould actualy be much easier as a newbie couse you can like cut a tree and then start to use it as a weapon =D hmm... will items be able to brake? like if you buy a "super mega expensive new fire sword" and then it brakes... it whould be more real but maybe more boring to... or atlest i think that =D

From: raeky
Date: 2002-07-26 01:22:34
In-Reply-To: 1596

yes items should be able to break. Substances should include a "fracture" point, and the engine should calculate how much "stress" was put onto the item with a blow to another object, then if its greater then its "fracture" point, the item will break.

This would be how arrows could penetrate a suit of steel, if the arrow carried enough "force" and the arrows head was strong enough, it would penetrate the armor and kill the wearer, or greatly hurt him. :P